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Hobbyking He 162

Old 03-16-2013, 04:55 PM
  #51  
xmech2k
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Good to see someone having some use out of this plane, though it sounds like you have to really work for it! Too bad they don't put out a nicer version.
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Old 03-17-2013, 06:45 PM
  #52  
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Originally Posted by xmech2k View Post
Good to see someone having some use out of this plane, though it sounds like you have to really work for it! Too bad they don't put out a nicer version.
You're right about the work aspect; this is one out of the box flyer that did not fly out of the box. A quirky plane in real life, and just as twitchy scaled down. As posted before, by the time I had everything sorted, it was basically destroyed, but the next one was a lot less drama, as I knew what to do. Once sorted, she is a nice , very scale looking and flying plane. Looking through the threads on RCG, lots of people have had mixed results, with quite a few outright failures. A 70mm EPP version would be good, but you would still have the basic aerodynamics to deal with ie, stubby wings, high thrust line, wobbles above the axis etc. It was a dead end design until very recently, when drones came into vogue, but that doesn't change a fundamentally flawed concept. Back to the mods though.....I am having a change of direction with the balsa sheeting. The added thickness and extra weight may not be the best solution, as lightness is crucial for a plane like this. I'm now considering using silkspan and white glue as a covering for the wings, as I can sand it off and apply the balsa sheets if it is needed. Painting the silked wings would be straight forward, and I can apply clear tape over the top of that to protect the finish, and add more strength for minimal weight gain. I know it sounds like I'm trying to crash proof it, but a one piece wing will fly better than a butt joined floppy two piece set up that does not even have a spar. More later......
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Old 03-17-2013, 07:18 PM
  #53  
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Pattern,
i've flown this model for 2 years now.mine has over 60 flights on it and it has never been an every day plane because of the handlaunch issues, but once airborne, it flies very well. even with a stock 64mm fan, motor and a 30 amp e.s.c.! i removed the gear and beefed up it's belly for landings with a bit of wbpu and fabric. i think an upgrade to the power plant would be a waste of time. making it faster, heavier and therefore more twitchy to fly..if i were ever to do another of these models it would need to be much larger, and with a very light wing loading.......
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Old 03-18-2013, 12:06 AM
  #54  
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Originally Posted by iflyrc1012 View Post
Pattern,
i've flown this model for 2 years now.mine has over 60 flights on it and it has never been an every day plane because of the handlaunch issues, but once airborne, it flies very well. even with a stock 64mm fan, motor and a 30 amp e.s.c.! i removed the gear and beefed up it's belly for landings with a bit of wbpu and fabric. i think an upgrade to the power plant would be a waste of time. making it faster, heavier and therefore more twitchy to fly..if i were ever to do another of these models it would need to be much larger, and with a very light wing loading.......
That was my findings. It really is a nice flyer. Just tricky to launch, as you have to remember the exact throttle setting and launch angle. Too much power and it pushes down in the dirt. Too little power and too much angle would probably cause a stall. I gave it to a friend who is a top notch pilot, and really enjoyed it. I agree with the power system comment. Mine came from RC Castle with an outrunner that I'm sure was on the cheaper end, but had plenty of power. The problem I initially had was simply using a lipo that wasn't quite up to par. With a decent 3s-1800 it had plenty of power. My buddy had been abusing it on 4s and had a number of flights without burning it out. I put a cheater in the intake to cool the battery and ESC in the fuse, which is probably why he got away with it, using a TBird 36.
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Old 03-18-2013, 04:44 AM
  #55  
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the problems with this bird are not insurmountable. and it really is worth trying to get dialed in. fun, reasonably fast (for a 64mm fan and 3 cells) and good looking in the air..good low cost e.d.f. and a unique subject...not a lot of them up and flying, I've never seen another one flown at any of the rallys and get togethers i go to.. I've had mine a few years now...about 50 or so flights on it
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Old 03-19-2013, 02:52 AM
  #56  
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Originally Posted by iflyrc1012 View Post
the problems with this bird are not insurmountable. and it really is worth trying to get dialed in. fun, reasonably fast (for a 64mm fan and 3 cells) and good looking in the air..good low cost e.d.f. and a unique subject...not a lot of them up and flying, I've never seen another one flown at any of the rallys and get togethers i go to.. I've had mine a few years now...about 50 or so flights on it
All these observations are pretty close to the mark I had enough faith in the plane to buy another one that is still in the box unopened, just in case they no longer became available. Getting it discounted dirt cheap helped too. There is a really good thread on RC groups about this plane, with some practical advice well worth looking into. I'm going to attempt a silkspan and white glue covering for the wings once repaired and joined to make a one piece section. I picked up an excellent book from Amazon with amazing detail and photos/drawings of the He 162 from every concievable angle, so it will make a good reference guide for the mods. When I eventually get my new camera I'll post how she turned out..cheers
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Old 03-19-2013, 04:08 AM
  #57  
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Thanks guys ! Now I'm inspired to bash one from a $10.00 Airhogs glider. Have a 66mm eflight edf in waiting.

-Hawk
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Old 03-19-2013, 04:39 AM
  #58  
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Originally Posted by dahawk View Post
Thanks guys ! Now I'm inspired to bash one from a $10.00 Airhogs glider. Have a 66mm eflight edf in waiting.

-Hawk
Can't wait. Be sure to post some pics of the project
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Old 04-08-2013, 12:29 AM
  #59  
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With the one piece wing in place, I had a surprisingly trouble free maiden, but thats where it ends. A weird radio glitch saw her lose all control, directly over the largest dam in the area, spiraling down into the water. I fished it out, dried all the components, and replaces the Rx. Once again she flew fine for about 2 minutes, then the loss of contact thing again, this time really crumpling the nose. Replaced everything bar the motor, with proven components, and third time lucky, lost contact again after about 1 minute. really strange....flying fine, then motor cuts, no response from the controls, and spirals in again....... No idea what is going on, as the Tx works fine with my other planes. Anyway, the EPP version will now go ahead, as I am pretty over these crap foam Arf's. She flew well once set up, so the concept is airworthy. Its' just the sheer fragility of the bottom end packing foam that puts me off, so the remains will be used as a template for the scratchbuild EPP version...more later
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Old 04-08-2013, 01:56 AM
  #60  
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if it crashed, then you replaced the R/X,,, THEN crashed again, in the same way, what makes you believe you T/X isn't responsible??? that's what i would blame...it's the only radio component common to both crashes....
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Old 04-08-2013, 03:57 AM
  #61  
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Originally Posted by iflyrc1012 View Post
if it crashed, then you replaced the R/X,,, THEN crashed again, in the same way, what makes you believe you T/X isn't responsible??? that's what i would blame...it's the only radio component common to both crashes....
Like i said, it is weird. I replaced the rx twice, after each crash, ( as well as move it to a different location on the plane), plus the ESC, and even the wiring harness the second time. I also tried the the same Tx and rx on my other planes with no problem at all. The only common factor is the motor, although I don't see how it could be to blame. To para phrase Sherlock Holmes, once you have ruled out everything, what you have left, no matter how improbable, is the answer. All I can think is that it was some sort of brownout ( electric fences, perhaps)....of course, it could be gremlins.....either way, it gives me an excuse to build one instead of putting up with crap chinese foam..
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Old 04-08-2013, 08:56 AM
  #62  
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Sorry to hear about this problem Michael. I was thinking over heating ESC until you said that you had replaced it. I guess if it was the same rated ESC it could exhibit an identical problem though.
I can guess how annoyed you are, as I would be, when you get an issue like this. I hope you get it sorted soon.
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Old 04-09-2013, 03:06 AM
  #63  
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Originally Posted by baz49exe View Post
Sorry to hear about this problem Michael. I was thinking over heating ESC until you said that you had replaced it. I guess if it was the same rated ESC it could exhibit an identical problem though.
I can guess how annoyed you are, as I would be, when you get an issue like this. I hope you get it sorted soon.
Hi Barry Yes, it was kind of annoying, seeing I replaced everything twice and still had the same problem I actually thought this was the end of the line for this one, but on arriving home from work very late last night, and still wide awake at midnight, I did the forensic thing again. Took a couple of hours, but I repaired the major damage, and got half way through building the EPP nose for it. The balsa reinforced fuse and one piece wing were in surprisingly good shape, and it was only the front third of the fuse that was shattered. Guess it looked alot worse than it actually was. The clear packing tape covering really helped once again. I'll start on the coreflute tail tomorrow, and maybe ready for another trial by the weekend. I also cut out a set of EPP wings as well, and am considering installing flaps, but that is still alittle way off yet. I've gotten kind of hooked a little on this plane now, because when it does fly, it actually is quite a lot of fun....more later, cheers
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Old 04-09-2013, 10:07 AM
  #64  
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Sadly Michael I've been doing almost the same thing with the Wellington. A stalled hand launch saw it land straight on it's nose!
The foam had compressed and deformed sideways. The hot water trick helped to straighten things up, however, I was concerned about the foam structure so I made a lipo sized sheet balsa box section which I fitted through the nose section and locked into place with gorilla glue foam to gap fill the space between the foam fuselage and the balsa.
This has proved to be very effective, it's now stronger than it was before and the receiver lipo fits into the balsa box section very easily.
One thing which really pleased me was that the pop bottle moulded front turret which took the full force was squashed flat. When I placed my finger inside and pushed it, it popped out into its original form with no sign of any damage at all.
Amazing material for making nose sections!!!
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Old 04-12-2013, 03:30 AM
  #65  
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Hi Barry, good to hear you fixed the Wellington without too many dramas; That plastic drink bottle material is a real bonus. Good news in this hemisphere as well......built the EPP nose using the original crushed one as a template, and it actually turned out pleasingly well. To keep the weight down, I used only 3M77 and gorilla glue, instead of hot glue, as EPP weighs more than that junk styro that starmax uses in this plane. Some balsa here and there, and presto!!! I put her back together again, and she flew as well as ever in the light breeze. Autumn is the calmest time of the year ( calm being a relative term), so I have to make the most of the nice days. And to think I considered this one ready for the scrap heap only last week. The way its going, I'll just keep replacing sections with EPP until the whole plane has been totally renovated. Sort of a 3D plan so to speak. Next is the coreflute tail, and twin servo's with decent connections. The flimsy starmax ones have lots of slop and play in them, and the "V" pushrod for the twin elevator is really thin and flexible. It still looks like a He162, but is a lot tougher and flies better than standard, so I'll just keep persevering with it. More later.....
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Old 04-12-2013, 11:42 AM
  #66  
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Good news Michael!!
" Never say never" is spot on!
Your experience just shows why it's such a good idea to repair and modify. After all if you can build the models out of chunks of foam in the first place there's really no reason why the post incident chunks shouldn't go back together again is there???
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Old 04-16-2013, 04:32 PM
  #67  
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Originally Posted by baz49exe View Post
Sorry to hear about this problem Michael. I was thinking over heating ESC until you said that you had replaced it. I guess if it was the same rated ESC it could exhibit an identical problem though.
I can guess how annoyed you are, as I would be, when you get an issue like this. I hope you get it sorted soon.
Very possible, especially if the ESC was internally fuse mounted, as I believe this plane calls for. Sounds like it was a BEC overtemp shutdown. I opened an cheater hole from the forward nacelle (in front of the fan) into the fuselage. It created a ventilation path from the slotted battery door, routing through the fuse and exiting the cheater hole into the nacelle. The vent path ran across the ESC, which is mounted inside the fuse.

I had a BEC overtemp shutdown, where the ESC was mounted in the fuse and poorly cooled, on a high draw EDF on 3s. With the setup I had, the servos were known to move on brownout, causing one to think it was a radio issue. By the time you reach the crashed model, the ESC will likely have cooled and will be working again. It generally takes a few minutes for the ESC to heat up before the overtemp shutdown occurs, as the heat from the FETs contributes to the overall temperature of the ESC, including the actual BEC chip. After the ESC has had time to build up heat, a drop in throttle will encourage a BEC shutdown even further, as the reduced load will cause a rise in battery voltage, stressing the linear BEC chip even further. That is what happened in my case, as the drop in throttle for landing approach is when the shutdown occurred. The linear BEC that shutdown was a lousy 1.5A chip also, versus a 3A chip that I believe a better ESC like the TBird 36 has, which is what was installed in my HE162. I gave my HE162 away to a friend, and he's even been getting away with using 4s lipo on the Castle TBird 36 equipped plane.

I stopped using ESCs with linear BECs rated under 3A on EDFs, and prefer ESCs like the newer Dynams with 3A switiching BECs. The Eflite ESCs with a low rated BEC chips apparently caused more BEC shutdown crashes than just mine, from what I read over the years, such as folks who invested high dollars in their Super Airliners, using Eflite ESCs with weak BEC chips. Eflite is just one of many brands using lower rated linear BEC chips on ESCs large enough to warrant a higher rated BEC chip, and was just used here as an example. IMO an ESC rated at 18A or higher should probably have a 3A linear BEC chip, unless of course they are using a swiching BEC.
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Old 04-17-2013, 04:23 AM
  #68  
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Good bit of investigative work there Bill All my EDF's have externally mounted ESC's (usually in the nacelle intakes), and they are all at least 40 amp rated, so cooling is never a problem. Before it was even maidened, I stripped out the electronics from the Heinkel, and replaced everything with the proven quality gear I use on all my planes. My one and only experience with ARF electrics taught me a prudent lesson. What I suspect may have happened was the signal being interfered with by the CF reinforcement along the fuse, so I moved the Rx to the cockpit. It made no difference, either did swapping out all the parts, servo's included. The only common component is the motor, which appears to cut out first before control is lost. I replaced the motor yesterday with another one, and it flew without a hitch. Unlikely, but it may have been an electrical surge with the cheap BL motor that this plane uses, but I suspect I am still guessing. I'm replacing the whole EDF unit with a better one anyway, so time will tell. She does fly better with a little dihedral and the added stiffness of one piece wings.....cheers.
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Old 06-26-2013, 10:26 PM
  #69  
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Just about to start work again on this, and see if the silk and varnish covering helps in the durability department. The coreflute tail is ready to fit on, although still undecided about the elevator servo set up. As a side note, does anyone know what ever happened to the EAM He 162 venture? I was looking up the german manufactured FVK He 162, which is no longer in production from what i can gather, and there was a link to the EAM company. It seems neither of these planes are currently avialable, but it would be nice to know if any one has one still flying. They both look like quality kits, compared to what is currently on offer. For the non-builders out here, it would be great if some one like Dynam or Durafly offered one as a kit or ARF
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Old 07-12-2013, 04:32 AM
  #70  
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Finally got some time to pull this apart and strip the packing tape off it. It came off surprisingly easy, as there is no need to spray any adhesive on this kind of foam. Being dunked in a dam several times also helped with the tape losing its adhesion The fuse had a major crack through the centre, which the tape had disguised, and will need some solid repair work before anything else. There are a myriad of little chunks missing, minor cracks and crumples everywhere, so I'll have some filling and sanding ahead of me. Structurally though, it is not as bad as I expected, and the wings and nacelle are actually quite unscathed. Those "Lippisch Ears" on the end of the wings may be replaced with coreflute though. Tail wise, it will definitely get a coreflute one, as the original foam tail feathers are extremely fragile, and account for about 90% of the running repairs. I'll probably run twin servos' for the elevators too, unless I can come up with a decent twin linkage. I'll get back to this thread when I'm ready to apply the silk and WBPU...cheers
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Old 07-13-2013, 09:20 PM
  #71  
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Surprisingly enough, I managed to have some spare time today to get started on this one. With all the tape stripped off, and the cracks and breaks repaired with 3m 77 and /or gorilla glue, I sanded down the main fuse and wings to an unexpectedly smooth finish. The nose and cockpit needed a fair bit of shaping, so I placed the 1/72 scale airfix he 162 next to it as a guide, and soon had it reasonably close. Not sure how the EPP nose will go with the EPO fuse main body, when it comes to covering it with the silk and WBPU, but I'm sure I'll find out. The wings were also sanded back, and the original foam ears retained after being repaired, so I may hold off on the coreflute ones for now. I can always replace them at a later stage anyway, if need be. I'll try and get some pics of the repaired and sanded fuse today, as it is bucketing down with rain...
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Old 07-24-2013, 04:06 AM
  #72  
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Default learning curve, again.

Against all odds, we are having a couple of sunny, calm days in the middle of winter. Having only one day off this week, I was able to try my hand at the silk and WBPU finish, never before attempted. Mixed results so far, but I can say that applying it over the EPP nose produced an interesting finish. The whole plane has now been silked, and the result is far from perfect, but it is for experimental purpose only on this plane. I've tried a number of different ways, methods, and techniques to get a half reasonable finish, but I'm still a long way from being proficient. The WBPU is a strange sort of texture; sort of claggy and lumpy and poorly strained porridge looking, nowhere as smooth and easy flowing as oil or solvent based finishes. The silk is beautiful though, very light and strong, and appears much more durable than silkspan. I think it would do very well applied with dope over a balsa framework, which I will most likely do over summer. I'm going to have a go at the water thinned spackle today as well, and give the whole thing a sand to see how it looks, but it is the strength of the whole plane that is the main focus. All going well, I should have her ready for a test flight by this coming Sunday
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Old 07-24-2013, 07:42 AM
  #73  
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Hi Michael, I'm glad the silk/varnish finish is starting to workout for you however I am confused by the "sort of claggy and lumpy and poorly strained porridge looking", water based varnish which you have managed to find.
The stuff I use is nothing like that being more like the consistency of very thin cream and looking more like milk when in the tin.. Even then I often add a touch of water if it is getting too draggy.
You are dead right about applying strips being better than attempting to cover with a large sheet, especially on tight compound surfaces.
I'm looking forward to see how the finish stands up to your flying environment.

Barry
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Old 07-24-2013, 09:55 AM
  #74  
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I use WBPU all the time, and I've only ever had it get clumpy if it was getting really, really old.
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Old 07-26-2013, 09:07 AM
  #75  
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Hmmm...looks like I may have gotten an old tin then. Still, it seems to work though, even if it is lumpy and curdled looking. It was the only water based product they had though, amongst literally hundreds of oil/solvent based finishes. I finished off the coreflute tail last night, and will attach it tomorrow sometime. All that is really left to do before re-assembly is to reinstall the electrics, and check everything works. I'll try and post some pics of the work in progress tomorrow, although after the hectic few weeks of work lately, I'm really tired, and could do with an early night. The best laid plans etc
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